AKC recognition

[Laneee]

Hi, all - Lane of Cerca Trova here.  We believe that AKC recognition is the downfall of many rare breeds.  Once the breed becomes better known, by virtue of AKC, the backyard breeders take over, with little or no regard for health, quality or the original use of the breed.  Furthermore, to many uninformed puppy seekers, the "AKC" is thought to be a stamp of quality.  This is far from the truth - Many puppy mill puppies are "AKC registered."

[Barba Bagnata Spinoni]

Well, without knowing how many Bracchi are in the US, it is a bit hard for me to offer an opinion if it makes sense. If the numbers are still low, I can't imagine why move forward with AKC recognition.  In order to gain a championship, there has to be multiple dogs entered, I believe 4 is the minimum for a major. That would be extremely difficult for most folks if the numbers are not in the thousands. I guess I would like to hear why or what the reasoning is to move forward with it.

As far as the Spinone goes, personally, I do not blame AKC for the breeders that have popped up all over the place. Those breeders got their dogs from well-known and established Spinone breeders. WHERE is the breed education? THOSE established breeders are the ones at fault for their puppy people, having a dog with a uterus or a penis, thinking it needs to be bred, without an educated eye to know if the dog OFFERS something to the gene pool - in many cases, no.  I will bet that exists now in the Bracco world.

To be clear about AKC recognition. One of the big reasons HAS to be to be able to show in conformation at AKC approved shows, yes?  Anyone that supports this - can you tell me the qualification of those that will be judging the dogs in the ring?  You might be surprised to know, there are no qualifications, in most cases. They are handed a standard and they judge based on THEIR interpretation of that standard, IF they have looked at it. Like the Spinone, the Bracco does not fall into a generic Sporting dog category - yet that IS how the Bracco will be judged in the ring.  Six years after AKC recognition, and I would wager a guess that only 25% of the judges have half a clue about the breed. That means that 75% of the judges, judging the Spinone, are clueless and their selections prove that.  Needless to say, with ignorant folk, or those that are followers (the majority too much of the time), they put value on these ignorant judges selections, and then choose to breed these dogs, that are mediocre at best. THEN, you start seeing the breed degenerate and loose it's original qualities.  I guess I am one that does not blame AKC, but that is probably because I don't care who the number one dog is - that means nothing to me in the Spinone world. Too many ignorant judges have put many of those dogs in the top ranking. But too many people put stock in that and believe those dogs are the best. This is what harms the breed.  So, is that AKC's fault, or ignorant people not being responsible and not learning about the qualities of the breed?

I do not think the future of the Bracco in the US needs to hinge on AKC involvement.  I think the Bracco is still in an infancy stage in the US and needs maturing before seeking AKC involvement.

Tammara

[goofy]

I am opposed to AKC recognition.  My fear in AKC recognition is that the breed will gain popularity and become the "darling of the show folks" and then the hunting instinct is bred out of the breed.  They are too rare here to go down that road.  The hunt instinct in the bracco is so raw and natural.  That is passed thru many generations of braccos that hunt.  They are almost primitive in their desire to hunt and it would be a shame to breed that out of them.  Many lines of Labs, Cocker Spaniels, Irish Setters, etc no longer have the ability to hunt because they have been bred for show dogs instead of hunting dogs.  Their popularity ruined what they were originally bred for.  Surprisingly, the poodle is one of the oldest hunting dogs......but they look more like fancy balls of fur in the show ring, than any hunting dog I have ever seen.  I am surprised that many posting are coming up here.....but nothing on hunting.  I wonder why people have a hunting dog, but never hunt with their dog.  Why buy a hunting dog?  As the breed gains in popularity, you will start to see them in shelters because their beloved puppy is suddenly destroying the backyard, jumping on people, energy level is too high etc.....  Why not just recognize them as the rare breed they are?  The only benefit for being AKC recognized is for the show people to campaign their dogs within that circuit.  A blue ribbon and CH. is strictly an ego boost for the owners.  If you asked the bracco, I'm sure they would say they would rather be in the field.......I am glad that the get together in San Diego Sept 2007 has 2 days focused on field work and not 3 days of dog shows.

[Barba Bagnata Spinoni]

If I may comment, showing a dog does not remove the hunt drive.  Breeding dogs without a strong drive or no drive will take it out of new lines. Breeding two dogs together with no drive will develop dogs without drive. It is impossible for showing to remove that from a dog.      

I have to agree with a few others that have discussed this elsewhere (emails), that with the limited numbers in the US (approx 300 dogs), AKC recognition is VERY far in the future. I think it needs to be removed from the table.  With only 300 dogs in the US, just how many of those would be showing across the country?  Maybe 50 dogs?  It would almost be impossible to finish a dog since getting the two required majors would be a major feat, except for those that are close and willing to make a major. I won't even address the judges that would be judging your dog.

Being a breeder of Spinoni, another rare breed, it is not common to have people require their pup be AKC registered. The only people that care, are those that plan to show in conformation. A whole litter is not placed with all show people (unless the breeder requires that and don't get me started on that one), but maybe one or two pups, maybe.  People that are drawn to the Spinone, and the Bracco, are drawn to it not because of what they can do in the show ring, so most people could care less about AKC registration or who might be a champion in the lines.

I haven't seen AKC wreck breeds - I have seen breeders wreck breeds.  AKC does not control what is being bred and produced. Granted, their judges, in a lot of cases, are incredibly ignorant and their selections in the ring many times in rare breeds is deplorable. But breeders are the ones that make the breeding choices, not AKC.

PEOPLE wreck a breed.   

[indijazz]

I so agree with Barbra on this one, coming from England where very few dogs are used just for working, maybe one or two dogs, maybe 4 or 5 are used for show and working the rest are just pets. My bracco Sophia is not worked only shown,but this does not stop her working ability, both litters she has produced, both to show only dogs have proved to be excellent at both working and conformation. I think people should aim to produce Bracco that are sound in all aspects, this will help there becoming a split in the looks of both sides, this have been proved for many years in the GSP where people have allways aimed for the same thing, most of our GSP's in England can do both working trails and then the next day showing because they are still breed to the same breed standard for either ability. Becoming AKC recognised will not make a difference to the breed it will be the people in it who will make or break it!!!!

[Tina F.]

It's not really AKC that wrecks the dogs. But what happens with AKC recognition is that more people will see the breed because AKC has the largest, most familiar dog show organization.  Everybody knows about the famous Westminster Kennel Club show (AKC recognized), but is the biggest UKC, or CKC, or ARBA, or FCI, etc show televised?  In this country I don't even think the World Dog Show is televised. So more people will see the dog. Unfortunately there are people that think they can make money by breeding a rare breed and demanding exhorbitant fees.  Those people don't care about standards.  They want to make "easy" and "quick" $$$.  Then poorly bred dogs are out and about for some other "breeder".  Or all the puppies can't get sold so they are dumped.  Some 20 years ago my husband and I got a Rottweiler.  Back then nobody knew what a Rottie was.  Five years later the breed was immensely popular.  Rotties were no longer what they used to be.  Temperaments, movement, body shape, and head shape no longer resembled what to me used to be the classic Rottweiler. For that reason we didn't get another. Another classic example of how breeds can be changed: look at the slope of the Irish Setter's back.  At one point they started resembling hyenas, and all for the show ring.  And German Shepherds too.  I used to see them in the show ring and wonder that they weren't crippled.
As previously stated, PEOPLE wreck a breed.  And AKC recognition accelerates that.

[sambracco]

I thinkthat AKC recognition of the breed is needed in the future in order to continue strong healthy growth of the bracco. I dont ever want to see the bracco become super popular breed like the poodle because they are a special breed with unique needs. however the breed almost died out in the 40 and 50 in Europe. If the number of healthy dogs are not increased the bracco may become an endangered breed once again. luckly the numbers are growing at a reasonable healthy rate.  I love this breed, but it is not for everyone. As for owning a hunting dog and not ever hunting, I have no problem with this concept. I grew up with with a english/pointer mix,named Speckles. I never went hunting with him. My dad tried by alas Speckles was gun shy.  He was a wonderful gentle dog. I learned that certain hunting breeds make great pets, ie basset hounds, golden ret., labs etc. SOme hunting breeds are now being used for other purposes because of the qualities that make them great hunting ie intelligence, gentle nature etc  I prefer hunting dogs as pets and I will never hunt. I have no problem with individuals that hunt but for me it holds no interest. I may never be able to own another bracco but Iwill always own some type of hunting breed for a pet.